AKA Fleur Black AKA Violet Gray
I debated putting this post up as I know I will get flamed.
But I do not like bigots or bullies, racists or homophobes.
I especially do not like most of the HBS/”Classic Transsexual” crowd who seem so obsessed with their being the only real transsexuals that they spend much of their lives trashing other post-transsexual women for not meeting their level of “purity of motivations”.
I tend to view this need to trash others who had the same surgery you had because you somehow imagine their motives were less pure than your own to be a form mental illness. A basic lack of both empathy and an understanding that you are not the only real transsexual on the planet, that we are closer to 1 in 1000 of the people on the planet which means there are a whole lot of us.
This is something that has escaped Rose White’s consciousness.
Something I find odd since Rose White is of a group, that is very easy for members of the group I am part of to throw stones at and question the motivations of. You see I came out young, which makes me part of the class who earlier on in the trans-wars put on the t-shirt that read “Primary”. While Rose White1 (who according to a Google search was still a pre-op as late as last year) is what we now call a late emerger. The sort of person my class, during those aforementioned wars referred to as a “Secondary”.
Some of us have outgrown playing those games of many years ago. We spent enough time and exercised our empathy enough to listen to and hear the stories of why people come out older. In the process we grew and gained understanding and sympathy for others beyond ourselves
No one ever said one could not be both a transsexual and a homophobe, a bigot, or ignorant.
My encounters with Ms. White/Black/Violet have run towards the unpleasant at best.
But I think someone needs say that the following crosses the line of decency in at least the same level of indecency as Autumn’s public trashing of Ashley.
Ban the drag acts, Pride chief urged
From The Halifax Courier UK: http://www.halifaxcourier.co.uk/news/local/ban_the_drag_acts_pride_chiefs_urged_1_3489298
Friday 17 June 2011 03:31
A WOMAN has said this weekend’s Calderdale Pride celebration should not include performances by drag acts.
Rose White, a transexual, has written to councillors and the organisers of Calder-dale Pride asking them to either ban the turns or publish a disclaimer about them.
She argues their appearance promotes negative stereotypes about transexuals and encourages hatred of those who have changed sex.
She said: “Drag queens – homosexuals dressed as women – and drag kings, women dressed as men, performing as stereotypical crossdressers promote, foster and reinforce the belief among the audience that any bloke in a frock must be a homosexual.”
Rose, 64, from Skircoat Green, said by allowing the acts to take to the stage they were breaching the Gender Equality Duty, which the council is bound to promote.
“The council needs to prevent anything that reinforces out-of-date stereotyping.
“If these people are allowed to perform in the town in the Pride, they must have a prominent sign stating ‘We are homosexual men – not transexuals’.
How about banning Rose white (Fleur Black/Violet Gray) instead because this person creates a negative impression that all transsexuals are ignorant bigots.
I just love it when know-it-all late emergers, who lived most of their lives with heterosexual male privilege, come out and make these “Last Real Woman” pronouncements.
This person is a total embarrassment and I hope people do not assume all transsexuals and post-transsexuals share this sort of bigoted opinion of gay and lesbian people.
What is even more seriously ridiculous is the idea that drag queens should wear signs proclaiming they are “gay men, not transsexuals”. Are those signs to be in the form of a Pink Triangle.
Perhaps Rose White is ignorant of the centuries long history of “drag” by both gay men and lesbians. It is a history that pre-dates by centuries our ability to find medical assistance with issues surrounding transsexualism.
But more important Drag at Pride Day Festivals is meant to mock the dominant heterosexual paradigm and is part of a long tradition of costuming for festivals and parties.
I actually remember Fleur Black one of Rose White’s aliases. she might well be one of the few people I automatically trash can without her postings even making it to the moderation queue. I remembered associating her with some pretty strange ideas regarding transsexuals and transsexualism.
I just love Google…
I find it interesting that Rose white considers herself such an expert in all things “true transsexual” given the amount of drivel in her e-book.
Fleur Black tried to get the following paragraphs into the Wikipedia:“Harry Benjamin Syndrome is not the same as transsexualism or transsexuality but is the medical correct term for the very small group of people who genuinely feel to be trapped in bodies that do not match their brain.“All who claims to be similar, but refuse to to accept the logic, tests, evidence and accuracy of HBS – Harry Benjamin Syndrome are bigots, fools, transgenders, transvestites, crossdressers or autocunniphilics.”(I love the word “autocunniphilics”, a great pun on Blanchard’s “autogynephilia”.)Violet Grey quotes this Wikipedia entry in her introduction to the book HBS Harry Benjamin Syndrome Comes of Age, a book written by Rose White.”Unfortunately,” Grey writes, “the Wiki board (…) allowed HBS to be lumped in with the transexualism label that many non-HBS crossdressing men claim in order to legitimise their autogynism and homosexual urges.”(And yes Black, Grey and White are probably the same woman).Harry Benjamin Part 2Rose White is explicitly considering her book a continuation of Harry Benjamin’s enormously important work The Transsexual Phenomenon. Benjamin had indeed argued that there were biological men who felt themselves trapped in a man’s body.White goes on explain why there is a natural continuation from his book, to the idea that the HBS syndrome is completely different from what people like me call other types of transgender conditions:“Harry advanced the study of truly transexed people and codified diagnostic criteria that has still not been improved on despite the protestations of generations of transgenders and it is only fitting that the condition should actually be known as Harry Benjamin Syndrome – or HBS – to separate its sufferers from all the gay, lesbian, bisexual, crossdressers, transvestites, transgenders, genderqueers, autogynes, non-ops and others who claim to be afflicted with exactly the same condition that Harry found when in fact they have nothing but various degrees of mis-nurturing to account for their weird urges.”Not transsexualOne major point in the book is the need for a term that does not associate the HBS transwomen with “transgenders”. You may already have met classical transsexual activists that redefine the word “transgender” to mean autogynephiliacs and effeminate gay men only. White takes this line of argument to the next level, by arguing that the word “transsexual” has become tainted as well.“In practices HBS do not like to have the word ‘transsexual’ applied to them as it has been adopted by a vast number of people who are not but not merely give the impression of being of opposite sex and/or gender to that they really are. Thus crossdressers, transvestites, genderqueers and similar claim the label ‘transsexual’ when in fact they are perfectly happy with their bodies and genitals and would not accept genital surgery if offered to them.”
Zagria has some interesting information on her blog/website: http://zagria.blogspot.com/2010_06_01_archive.html
- Rose White writing as as Violet Grey. Harry Benjamin Syndrome Review. CompletelyNovel. 2010. www.completelynovel.com/books/102047/read-online
You can read the entire book online.
Charlotte Goiar has put a link to the book on the HBS International (English) site, but only to the PayLoadz site where you can pay for it without seeing it. There is no link to the CompletelyNovel site. Nor is it admitted that Violet Grey is Rose White.
Actually, CompletelyNovel give the books title as Harry Benjamin Syndrome Review, but internally the title is given as Transsexual Phenomenon #2: HBS: Harry Benjamin’s Syndrome comes of age.
While the book is claiming to be a successor to Harry Benjamin’s Transsexual Phenomenon, there are no footnotes, no bibliography and no index. Internal citations to other publications are usually either wrong or inadequate, and she freely replaces ‘transsexual’ with ‘HBS’ in quotations from others without editorial brackets and without clarity that she is doing so. A very serious defect is that the page numbers given on the contents page are plain wrong: e.g Chapter 6 is said to be on p37, but it actually starts on p44.
The first 18 chapter comprise 108 pages, and each make a short point. Chapter 19 alone is another 108 pages, and rambles and rants. I suspect that many readers will skip the last chapter.
Jargon. In addition to ‘HBS’ which is unquestioned here (as you would expect from the book’s two titles), there are other usages which need to be explained. Fortunately she devotes chapter 2 to how she uses some of the words.
- With other HBS advocates, Rose uses SAS (Sex Affirming Surgery) instead of SRS (Sexual Reassignment Surgery), a change that I am fully in agreement with.
- She and they say ‘gender’ where most of us would say ‘gender identity’. This is confusing, but this misuse is not confined to HBS persons, and in fact is a usage popularized by Virginia Prince.
- ‘Mangina’ was a term used by Joseph Kirchner after his return to being male. I have never seen any other person identify with the term. Rose and HBS persons have imposed this term on men who wish for or have acquired a vagina without becoming a woman. They show no interest in the self-chosen terms used by such men.
- She and others use BLZB, sometimes expanded to Beelzebub, which means Blanchard, Lawrence, Zucker and Bailey. Rose sometimes writes as if this were one person or one thing.
White-Black-Grey also has some personal usages that need to be spelt out.
- As already mentioned, she persistently writes ‘autogyne’ instead of ‘autogynephilic’: “Autogyne (sic) was conjured up by Ray Blanchard, leader of the Beelzebub gang at Toronto’s CAMH” (p13).
- She uses the old-fashioned, not to say patronizing, GG=Genuine Girl for cis women, and Norm for cis men.
- She often uses HBS, transgender etc as nouns, as against the common opinion that they should be used only as adjectives.
- Body Clocking Effect (p16). Rose claims that an HBS woman on estrogen ends up looking 15 years younger, while a lesbian will look like an old man by her fifties.
- BRSS=Bindel-Raymond-Stein Syndrome. See below. One can understand Rose putting Bindel and Raymond into this, but who is Stein? It turns out to be Gertrude. I don’t know of Gertrude Stein being transphobic, and Rose does not produce any such evidence.
- FBMS=Fourrat-Bailey-McHugh Syndrome. See below.
- IPAP=Induced Pheromic Addiction Perversion. See below.
- Anne Vitale Effect. She uses this term but does not define it. I used Google to find Rose defining it here: “Effect of rising testo needing feminine expression followed by falling testo causing lack of female thinking and the urge to purge”. See also here where Lilacwoman (presumably Rose again) sends readers to Anee Vitale’s TNote 15.
- Natalie-Rose Syndrome. An increased need to urinate as the prostate has shrunk and the bladder is sitting lower.
- MBEPR=Malignant Bisexuals’ Ego Protection Reflex.
- Bigots and Fools. This is the title of Chapter 10. Enemies are “the Fouratist homo, the public, the press, bigots and fools, ignorant medics, penny pinching political manipulators, BRSS dykes, religious pedophiles, closet homos and … Manginas”. She particularly decries writers Fourat, Bindel, Burchill, Batty and Raymond. You may know who each of these are, but in this book they are simply denounced with no explanation. This is the most homophobic chapter with its obsession about oral sex and wild fantasies of what oral sex does. See more below.
Some of her points:
- HBS are not “crossdressers, manginas. transgenders, autogynes, wimps, perverts, genderqueers, genderbenders, drag queens, fetishists, drag kings, transvestites, AIS, Klinfelters, hermaphrodites, male post-ops, female post-ops, non-ops, closet gay, closet lesbians, gays who have ingested too much sperm over the years, lesbians who have ingested too much vaginal secretions, people who have been exposed to unrecognised chemical poisoning at work or in the environment, mental cases” (p24). An HBS, unlike the experts and the transgenders, can tell another HBS from all of the above.
- She explains that Harry Benjamin was a researcher in Chicago (p1). She must be better informed than other writers who thought that he worked in New York and San Francisco only.
- “We are all descended from Adam and Eve” (p28).
Read more: http://zagria.blogspot.com/2010_06_01_archive.html#ixzz1PmHaOo7r
Under Creative Commons License: Attribution
The problem with living in glass houses is that it makes throwing stones a risky proposition.
One of the things I have noticed about a number of the most fervent supporters of things such as HBS, “true transsexual”, and “classic transsexual” is that when I actually dig into their material a bit or their biographies, I often find people who wouldn’t meet the criteria they are setting forth.
It is almost as though they are trying to convince themselves.
I’ve also noticed many are late emergers and I think that plays a part of this phenomena. It’s weird when they attack people who have managed their lives 10, 20, 30, 40 years and more post-SRS and even post-transsexual. I find a newly transitioned person claiming to know so much more than a woman with years of actual experience being a woman to be very androcentric and dismissive of the lives these women have lived.
- http://www.prfire.co.uk/press-release/transsexual-files-claim-in-european-court-of-human-rights-9535.html Rose White a pre-op male-to-female transsexual has filed a claim for punitive damages in the Eurpean Court of Human Rights, Strasboug, France.